Comments on: Why a Winning Bidder May Become a Non Paying Bidder Domain blog featuring domain investing strategy, domain valuation, and domain development commentary from Elliot Silver, founder of Top Notch Domains, LLC. Wed, 30 Jul 2014 04:46:25 +0000 hourly 1 By: Glenn Madden Fri, 10 Feb 2012 03:22:22 +0000 I have been contacted by these clowns. One time I was interested in what they were offering for $300, went to GD and found it expiring, and purchased it through GD auction for $12. Great way to get advance notice of names I like, keep sending me offers.

By: LindaM Fri, 10 Feb 2012 02:13:21 +0000 Its funny because I was pondering this kind of thing earlier as I have a 5 figure ‘sale’ at sedo still awaiting payment.
It struck me that you could put competitors out of the market for a week at a time on their best names.
Just bid $100 on all of them, they will counter and you just ignore it. They’re legally obligated to leave the name dead in the water for 7 days and not sell it to anyone else.
On the off chance they hit accept then awesome, you get a great name. Otherwise though, they wont be selling it to anyone for a week. Rinse and repeat. Across a whole portfolio that could hurt.

Why is there a mandatory 7 day thing anyway, seems a bit excessive to me.

By: Gazzip Fri, 10 Feb 2012 01:30:34 +0000 No worries, I thought I was going senile and talking to myself ;)

By: Niklas Thu, 09 Feb 2012 21:08:42 +0000 I’m so sorry Gazzip, i wrote wrong name before because i was going to reply to you, but yes it’s a nice username.
Yes people don’t tend to reply if the know your not going to sell at that price then they just go after next name. I guess some are lowballers to…

By: Gazzip Thu, 09 Feb 2012 18:19:53 +0000 Gazzip to Gazzip2 (who’s not me)

A handshake or an agreement should be enough, but very often it isn’t.

“Next time i will write “All offers accepted by be are legal binding”

Sedo does that but unless you’re willing to back it up with legal action then its pointless.

What I do hate is when someone gives you a crappy $60 offer at sedo and they leave it open for 7 days without taking two minutes to cancel it if they are not interested in your counter. That’s just ignorant.

Please wait for buyer’s response

ps, nice username Gazzip :)

By: Anthony Thu, 09 Feb 2012 16:34:43 +0000 Acro

Fair enough with the example you give, I was thinking more along the lines of, etc

For me offering a frontrunning service to the TM holder on these types of domains is the lesser evil.

By: – Technology Rants & Raves by Acroplex® » Blog Archive » A short list of Domain Scum Thu, 09 Feb 2012 16:24:52 +0000 [...] A post by Elliot Silver yesterday raised again the issue of unscrupulous and unethical practices in domaining. [...]

By: Acro Thu, 09 Feb 2012 16:16:21 +0000 Gazzip – Exactly. Front-runners that do this trickery put the legitimate winner of an auction at unnecessary risk.

By: Gazzip Thu, 09 Feb 2012 15:18:58 +0000 @Gazzip well i do mind if it’s winning bid, then i think they are obligated to buy the name.
Not long ago a handshake was enough and binding now people seems to think that that they have the right to change his or her mind (all the time).
This happened to me just a week ago a friend tells me he wanted to buy a mobile phone from me, he didn’t check the prices and when he comes back from holiday i tell him it’s worth $100 then he says “oh i changed my mind i found my old one is this ok….”
now his friends is going to send it back to me 3 weeks after he “bought it”
Next time i will write “All offers accepted by be are legal binding”

By: Big Daddy Thu, 09 Feb 2012 15:15:48 +0000 I am sorry to be the bearer of bad news but, as I know from experience, fake bidders getting in the last bid happens all the time if there is no way to assure they have to pay. The last TRAFFIC require bidders to pre register and get qualified as having the money and being serious.
Just sayin.

By: Gazzip Thu, 09 Feb 2012 15:07:14 +0000 “ is auctioned on NJ and the frontrunning “expert” contacts ExampleSports offering to secure their “tm” or “brand” and bid on their behalf. For tm issues that’s where the WIPO comes in place.”

That is a blatant disregard for the guy who ends up winning and puts them at great risk of losing their recent purchase. Much worse than non payers.

I have a six figure non payer at sedo right now, he’s been security checked, emailed, phoned and still no money.

I really don’t mind if people change their mind because they found another domain but the least they can do is say so.

By: Romod Thu, 09 Feb 2012 14:32:00 +0000 I get these emails all the time from people “front running” the expiration. The topper had to be a domain I wasn’t planning on renewing last week that I got an email on asking if I wanted to buy it because it was soon to be made available to them. Scummy is an understatement.

By: Acro Thu, 09 Feb 2012 14:22:45 +0000 Anthony, read my post again; the alleged tm’s are simply amateur estimates e.g. if is auctioned on NJ and the frontrunning “expert” contacts ExampleSports offering to secure their “tm” or “brand” and bid on their behalf. For tm issues that’s where the WIPO comes in place.

By: Anthony Thu, 09 Feb 2012 13:47:47 +0000 There are a couple of separate issues that have to be dealt with here:

Non payment -

People should be banned from venues when they dont pay, that or they have to have money held in their account, as you can do with Namejet. Namejet T&Cs states that people will be banned from non payment so does GD, dont know if they follow through with this though.

Frontrunning -

Acro I read your article and I have read the article on NP on the guy front running there. These are two types of frontrunning.

Typo or TM frontrunning (as in Acros blog) as far as I see is not a bad thing as it is likely only to prevent a squatter sitting on the domain anyway. That squatter would not approach the TM holder to sell as they would be smarter than that so the frontrunner in this instance isnt closing sales avenues should they lose the bidding.

The frontrunning of generic domains is slightly different as the person will destroy avenues that the eventual winner of the domain may wish to pursue.

Non payment is wrong and should lead to being banned. Frontrunning is a personal question that an individual must ask themselves if they are comfortable with. In relation to winning typos and TMs I think frontrunning is the lesser evil compared with squatting. The generic frontrunning, if you read the NP thread, can be very profitable. Some may see this as “slimy, underhanded” etc others will see this as clever.

I do neither, but thought I would share my 10 cents.

By: Niklas Thu, 09 Feb 2012 13:35:01 +0000 But can you claim that he has to buy if he agrees on the price?
it’s not like he signed anything but have all the email correspondance…

By: dimensionfifth Thu, 09 Feb 2012 13:29:41 +0000 @elliot
I’m taking back my words :)

By: Elliot Silver Thu, 09 Feb 2012 13:28:25 +0000 @ dimensionfifth

I don’t think that’s the case. I’ve flipped many names I bought at drop auctions – most of them fairly quickly.

By: dimensionfifth Thu, 09 Feb 2012 13:26:46 +0000 Short, brief and to the point. This is why I don’t get involved in many backorders, the x-owner probably made all the home work by contacting potential buyers who weren’t interested…and so x-buyer decided to drop.

By: Rahul Thu, 09 Feb 2012 13:07:05 +0000 It not only happens while selling domain names but also with websites.
I am a fulltime flipper and its really frustrating when the buyer don’t respond after the end of auction.

By: unknowndomainer Thu, 09 Feb 2012 13:00:29 +0000 @Ron

If you’re 10 name in (failure to complete sale you’ve pre-organzed) then you obviously don’t understand risk-adjusted bidding and front running. If you’re doing it right you inventory should not be growing as rapidly as your turnover.

Many of those who condemn a tactic operate on similar lines themselves. No one tries to buy high and sell low, do they. We all say it’s unethical to Sell High and THEN Buy Lower… but there’s a fine line between that and Buying Below Low market value and then Selling High to end users we know.

The domainer dream is a good FLIP and most people will tell you it’s too hard to flip expiring/expired names so flip what? Domainers flip names they KNOW are being sold under priced and then sell them OVER PRICED.

All pure domainers are low ballers. Brokers professionalize screwing both ends of the market. That’s reality.